Caste has no place in Sangh, we are all Hindus: RSS sarkaryavah Dattatreya Hosabale

On the occasion of Yugadi, the Vikrama Weekly of Karnataka is bringing out a special edition titled "Sangha Shatamana" (Sangh’s Centenary). As part of this special issue, RSS Sarkaryavah Dattatreya Hosabale gave an exclusive interview to Vikrama. Over nearly two and a half hours, he spoke with Vikrama’s Editor, Ramesha Doddapura, about the Sangh, society, temple revival, and the road ahead.

Vikrama: One of the unique traditions of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) is its Shakha. Though it is a completely open activity, no one has been able to replicate it successfully. While the conduct of the Shakha is open to all to witness, what is the ‘secret’ behind its success? How is it that only RSS has been able to establish and sustain such a simple yet structured system?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: The Shakha is a system that was devised over a century ago for man-making. If a Shakha exists in a town or village, it signifies the presence of the Sangh there. The founder of the Sangh, Poojaniya Dr. Keshav Baliram Hedgewar, had participated in the freedom movement and various other activities, gaining immense experience in the process. Out of that experience, the concept and methodology of the Shakha emerged. Dr. Hedgewar must have thought deeply about this system.

 

As you rightly pointed out, the Shakha is a completely open, daily one-hour activity held in public spaces. It is extremely simple and has no secrets. However, while it is simple, it is not easy. Though the Shakha format is straightforward, it requires daily participation for years, making it difficult to sustain. It demands a certain mindset, discipline, dedication, and perseverance without expecting immediate results.

 

Some have attempted to imitate the Shakha, but selflessness, perseverance, and a spirit of sacrifice are required to sustain it. Without these qualities, such attempts have not been successful. The spirit of camaraderie and emotional bonding forms the foundation of a Shakha. There is a popular Sangh song that says, "Shuddha Satvik Prem apne Karya Ka Aadhar Hai" (Pure and selfless love is the foundation of our work). The 100-year history of the Sangh has proven that this is the most effective model for social organisation and transformation.

 

Vikrama: Another distinctive feature of the Sangh is the Pracharak system. When Dr Hedgewar conceptualised this system, was there any precedent or model for it in the Bharatiya tradition?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: There are multiple interpretations regarding the origins of the Pracharak system in the Sangh. However, the exact source from which Dr. Hedgewar derived this idea is not definitively known. In fact, our society has long upheld a tradition of Sadhus and Sants who dedicate their lives to the nation, Dharma, and spiritual pursuits, setting aside personal aspirations. For thousands of years, we have had sages and saints who selflessly worked toward a higher cause. Similarly, during the freedom struggle, many youths renounced personal ambitions and devoted themselves entirely to the movement. Dr. Hedgewar himself emerged from such an environment.

 

Samarth Ramadas introduced the concept of ‘Mahanth’ in Maharashtra which closely resembles the life of a Pracharak. Though Dr. Hedgewar never explicitly mentioned adopting this concept, given that he started the RSS in Maharashtra, it is possible that he was influenced by such ideas. Doctor Ji himself set an example for dedicating oneself to society. If we look at it that way, Doctor Ji is the first Pracharak of the Sangh.  His vision was that a Shakha could be established anywhere in Bharat and Pracharaks could emerge from any corner of the country. This ability to grasp the dynamics of the diverse cultural and linguistic landscape of Bharat and being able to come up with these two ideas was his speciality. Such far-sightedness and strategic vision are not found in an ordinary individual or a mere intellectual thinker. Unfortunately, we do not have extensive written works or speeches from Dr. Hedgewar that could provide deeper insights into his thought process.

 

Vikrama: How can the personality of Dr Hedgewar be described?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: He was a true visionary, what in English is called a "seer". He could foresee the future and anticipate what lay ahead. His personality was self-effacing as he never sought personal recognition or fame. Since he was involved in revolutionary activities , he never have practice of documenting his own work. Once, when a writer approached him, saying he wanted to write about his life, Dr. Hedgewar firmly refused. For him, the organisation was everything, and all his contributions were dedicated to the Sangh’s mission. He never spoke about himself or his achievements. It was only during his birth centenary celebrations in 1989 that many in the country saw his photograph for the first time. Until then, people knew about the Sangh but did not know anything about its founder. 

 

Vikrama: Many organisations that started in the country have faded away. Some have survived but lost their influence. However, the RSS has not only maintained its existence but also expanded and remained unified. Haven’t there been any internal or external attempts to weaken or dismantle the Sangh? How do you view this?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: As I mentioned earlier, RSS Swayamsevaks share a deep bond of camaraderie and mutual respect, which has prevented any internal rifts within the organization. All discussions within the Sangh are open, and once a decision is made, everyone adheres to it. There is no scope for personal ambition or prestige. The collective good of the organization is the primary focus for everyone. The second aspect is the unwavering confidence of the Swayamsevaks in each other. Third, the mindset that there may be differences in the belief systems, but there should be no differences in the mind.

 

The daily Shakha and the structured working system of the Sangh play a crucial role in fostering such an attitude. There may have been external attempts to divide or weaken the Sangh, but this fortress of resilience has remained impenetrable.

 

Vikrama: Caste remains a social reality even today. Given that the RSS has been working with society for so many years, hasn’t caste-based discrimination or division affected the organisation? How has the Sangh remained ‘Insulated’ from this issue?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: The Sangh includes people from all traditions, sects, and castes. However, it has never adopted the customs or rituals of any particular caste or sect. The Shakha follows only a minimal set of practices necessary for its functioning. Caste is never a topic of discussion in the Sangh. The first lesson taught in the RSS is that we are all Hindus. The way to reduce the divisive lines of caste is by drawing a larger unifying identity, which is Hindu unity. Thus, caste has no place in the Sangh. There is a discipline in the Sangh that its workers must not be actively involved in caste-based organizations. As a result, RSS swayamsevaks do not hold leadership positions in any caste-based groups. Efforts to eradicate caste through confrontation only reinforce caste divisions. In 1974, during his Vasanta Vyakhyanmala (Lecture Series), the third Sarsanghchalak  Balasaheb Deoras stated: “Let caste be erased from society. Let it go more smoothly, but there is no need to lament that caste is going away.” The rigid caste hierarchy does not allow social mobility; as Dr. B.R. Ambedkar described it, it is ‘a multi-storied building without a staircase’. However, within the RSS ecosystem, many inter-caste marriages have taken place, but the Sangh has never used this for publicity. Since RSS swayamsevaks deeply internalise the idea of Hindu unity, they remain above caste divisions.

 

Vikrama: Has the Sangh’s approach of treating caste as immaterial had any impact on society? Is it possible to measure this? Another issue is the view that diversity in India has so far remained based on caste, and there are sayings that if caste disappears, diversity will also vanish. How can this be understood?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: The argument that caste must be preserved only to maintain diversity is not conducive to national unity. India’s geographical and natural diversity ensures that social diversity will always exist. It is incorrect to say that caste alone is necessary to maintain diversity. If caste remains confined to family traditions or domestic practices, it does not harm society. However, if caste is used to discriminate or determine political power, it becomes a problem for society. The Sangh has always urged that a system be put in place through society and the Constitution to eliminate this deficiency for those who have been deprived of respect, opportunity, and equality based on birth (caste). Has the Sangh’s stance on caste influenced society? Yes, it has. While this change is not solely due to the Sangh, many individuals have worked toward this goal. With changing times, caste barriers are naturally weakening. Today, we see IAS officers, sports persons, film stars, and IT professionals choosing their life partners based on career and compatibility rather than caste. This trend is increasing, gradually shifting caste identities.

 

Vikrama: Many who strongly advocate for caste abolition have ironically turned into staunch casteists themselves…

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: Caste is being used as a tool for political power-play. Many who claim to follow the maker of the Constitution, Dr BR Ambedkar’s ideology are deeply involved in caste politics, forming parties and power groups based on caste identity. Without fostering a national consciousness with the belief that "This is one nation, and we are all one people", a solution cannot be found to this problem. 

 

Vikrama: The founder of the Sangh did not want the Sangh to celebrate its centenary. How should we view this centenary in the light of Hedagewar's thoughts? Is it a time for celebration or time to introspect as to why the goal could not be achieved as soon as it had thought?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: True. Dr. Hedgewar had a desire that “I should see the society organised while I am in this same body, with these same eyes.” This is why the Sangh did not celebrate its twenty-fifth, fiftieth or seventy-fifth anniversaries. “Is this really the occasion to celebrate, or should we introspect as to why we have not yet accomplished our goal?” Poojaniya Sarsanghchalak Dr. Mohan Bhagwat had suggested in a Baithak. It is indeed a time for introspection. But there is no need to be self-deprecating. The Sangh has been able to instill self-confidence in Hindu society due to the penance, sacrifice, and perseverance of the Sangh Swayamsevaks and the cooperation of the society. The positive results of Hindu reawakening and organised power are visible. When we look at the path we have come, we feel proud and feel that we have done what we could. But there is also a sense of regret and incompletion. Therefore, there is no plan to celebrate the centenary. However, there are plans and agendas to strengthen the Sangh’s work more effectively and qualitatively. Dr Hedgewar never accepted idea that foreigners were responsible for our societal issues: RSS' Dattatreya Hosabale

 

Vikrama: What have been the major obstacles preventing it from fully achieving its goal in these hundred years? Is it due to societal conditions, political forces, or foreign influences?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: It is a combination of all these factors. I wouldn’t blame foreign powers because Dr Hedgewar himself never accepted the idea that foreigners were responsible for our societal issues. Foreign powers could only take advantage of the weaknesses that already existed in our society. For centuries, caste divisions, personal egos, and linguistic and regional differences have created fragmentation within Indian society. The lack of self-esteem, selfishness, and lack of unity are the real obstacles. Another major challenge has been the post-independence political landscape. Instead of uniting society, political movements have further deepened divisions for narrow electoral gains. This short-sighted and selfish politics has been a significant hurdle for Sangh's work. Despite all these challenges, there is a deep sense of devotion toward Bharat among its people. When an Indian athlete wins on the international stage, or when a soldier is martyred at the border, people don’t consider their caste, region, or language, and every citizen reacts emotionally. Similarly, service-mindedness and cultural awareness are increasing. However, this spirit must not be occasional but should become a way of life. The Sangh is working towards making this spirit a life’s vision.

 

Vikrama: On the occasion of its centenary, the Sangh has set two key goals: increasing the number of shakhas to one lakh and implementing the concept of Panch Parivartan . These concepts do not align with the usual discourse associated with ‘Hindutva’ as identified with the Sangh. Is this merely a change in words, or does it indicate a shift in perspective?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: All of this is rooted in the ideological foundation of the Sangh. Just like the concept of Progressive Unfoldment, as we move forward, new dimensions open up. Hindutva is not some abstract spiritual preaching; it is related to life itself. Hindutva does not merely mean repealing Article 370, cow protection, or the construction of the Ram Mandir in Ayodhya as it is made out to be. Everything encompassed in Panch Parivartan is also Hindutva. Every aspect related to life is included in it. Adapting to changing times is the very nature of Hindu society. Isn’t that why our tradition has Smritis, which reinterpret dharma according to contemporary needs without abandoning its foundation? As DV Gundappa  said, “A tree flourishes when new shoots emerge alongside its old roots, and dharma thrives when new reasoning is integrated with ancient principles.” True to this, in a living society, change must happen from time to time. The RSS has upheld this idea from the very beginning. From this perspective, Panch Parivartan is both Rashtra Dharma and Yuga Dharma.

 

Vikrama: The RSS used to strongly advocate for Akhand Bharat on several occasions in the past. The observance of Akhand Bharat Sankalp Diwas continues to take place to this day. However, in recent times, the topic of Akhand Bharat has not been prominently mentioned in the speeches of Sangh functionaries and senior leaders. Does this indicate a shift in the Sangh’s stance? What is the organisation’s current position on Akhand Bharat?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: The idea of Akhand Bharat is not just about geographical unity. Regardless of the religious practices followed by different people in this country, we have always emphasised that we are one. It is not only about creating Akhand Bharat but also ensuring that the existing Bharat and its society remain united and strong. As for geographical unity, there has been no change in our stand. Even today, Akhand Bharat Sankalp Diwas is observed. However, we must recognise that global geopolitics has undergone significant changes. If the Hindu society within Bharat is not strong and organised, merely speaking about Akhand Bharat will not yield results. When Bharat and Hindu society collectively display their strength, the world will acknowledge it. Akhand Bharat is our life’s dream and a vow. There is no dilution in our commitment. But if a region that was once divided is to reintegrate, is the Bharatiya society prepared to absorb and assimilate it? If not, merely talking about this dream will not yield any results.

 

Vikrama: The organisations associated with the Sangh are referred to as the Sangh Parivar . Are all these organisations making an impact on society in line with their founding objectives? Is there a system in place to evaluate their effectiveness?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: The Sangh has not created these organisations as part of a structured plan. Rather, Swayamsevaks, driven by their social responsibility and duty, have established these organisations in various respective fields based on the ideals and experiences gained from the Sangh. The Sangh does not evaluate these organisations. The only measure it applies is to see how much Sangh Sanskar (rites of passage) and Sanghattva exist within them. Over the past 50 years, most of the organisations established by Swayamsevaks have reached the top in their respective fields in terms of strength, reach, and impact. Whether they have fully achieved their objectives is difficult to say, as there are numerous challenges. However, these organisations have been quite successful in addressing the issues in their respective domains. They have established several positive traditions and upheld the flag of nationalism. Whatever work a Swayamsevak undertakes must be impactful. The evaluation of their success must be carried out by the respective organisations themselves, and they are indeed doing so.

 

Vikrama: Today, English-medium education has become commonplace. The Supreme Court itself  has stated that the right to choose the medium of instruction lies with parents, not the government. Parents are increasingly opting for English. Even Sangh's swayamsevaks are inevitably enrolling their children in English-medium schools. Educational institutions inspired by the Sangh are also setting up English-medium schools. At the same time, the Akhil Bharatiya Pratinidhi Sabha (ABPS)  has a resolution advocating education in the mother tongue. In this context, how should we view the role of language in preserving our identity?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: It is universally acknowledged by education experts and psychologists that acquiring knowledge in one’s mother tongue is easier and more natural. That is why we emphasise the importance of mother tongue education. If individual freedom in choosing the medium of education is considered crucial, then shouldn't concern for our culture be equally important? Language is not just a medium of expression; it is a manifestation of culture. Hence, it must be viewed not just as an individual right but as a cultural responsibility. Therefore, preserving Bharatiya languages and mother tongues is essential. The languages of our nation and their literary heritage are on par with any world literature. All our languages have produced profound literary works. If future generations do not read and write in these languages, how will they survive? The fascination with English exists primarily due to practical reasons such as better job opportunities, prospects of going abroad, and social prestige. A permanent solution must be found for this. Another key aspect is creating an economic model where those educated in Bharatiya languages have ample job opportunities. Senior intellectuals, judges, educationists, writers, and political and religious leaders must adopt a progressive stance on this matter. If the three-language formula is properly implemented, it is estimated that 95% of the problem will be resolved.

 

Vikrama: Instead of implementing language naturally, attempts were made to impose it, which perhaps led to setbacks in this effort.

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: There was a bit of politics involved in this, along with the stubbornness and arrogance of some people regarding their language. "One should have pride in their language, but not arrogance. There should be insistence, but not obstinacy," said D.V. Gundappa. If such statements need to be made, doesn't it mean that such attempts had indeed taken place? This applies to all languages.

In a vast country like this, it would be wonderful if everyone learned Sanskrit. Even Dr. Ambedkar had advocated for it. Or, there is no harm in learning a language spoken by a large number of people. Isn't that our language, too? Today, every soldier learns Hindi. Those who need employment learn the language of the respective state. The problem arose when this was turned into an issue of imposition due to politics and opposition. Hasn't Bharat remained unified for thousands of years despite linguistic diversity? How was it managed earlier? It seems that we have turned language into a problem today.

 

Vikrama: Politics has played a significant role in complicating not just language but several issues. "Politics cannot unite society; at best, it can only divide," said Sarsanghchalak Dr Mohan Bhagwat. Politics is creating divisions in society. What efforts is the Sangh making to counter this?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: Sangh has not formulated any specific plan for this. But we must reflect on why politics is operating in this manner. Leaders like Deendayal Upadhyay, Ram Manohar Lohia, Mahatma Gandhi, Madan Mohan Malaviya, and Swami Sampurnanand practiced politics rooted in culture. However, their followers have failed to uphold it or have succumbed to self-interest. We should not categorise people in one party as patriots and those in another as traitors. Patriotism and nationalism should be the common foundation for all parties. But, Many, without reasoning, have accepted what foreigners have said about our country. Unless this changes, the objectives and narratives of political parties will not change. The presence of multiple political parties in the country is neither an obstacle nor a division for society. However, in the interest of the nation, the national consciousness should be unified. Differences in policies may come and go. 

Dattatreya Hosabale: This is a subject that requires deep thought. We have the saying "Raja Kaalasya Karanam," meaning the ruler determines the times. Another perspective is that the times create the ruler. The term raja here represents governance, administration, and the state. The influence of the ruler is inevitable, but the quality of governance depends on the cultural foundation of that ruler. A state remains neutral in nature. When Rama governs, it becomes Rama Rajya. When dharma prevails, it becomes Dharma Rajya. But in the absence of these values, the state becomes a tool for selfishness, power struggles, tyranny, and even despotic rule. Therefore, culture must exert a moral influence over the state. This moral influence should not come from just one or two individuals or a single organisation but must be shaped by a structured societal system. This is why democracy and the Constitution are well-suited to our society. When great scholars debated the Constitution, they considered all aspects in depth. We have an inherent system of checks and balances. No one can move forward purely out of arrogance or self-interest. The reason politics dominates everything today is that society has not yet developed a strong autonomous framework for governance. As a result, political influence extends into all aspects of life. Society itself needs to become more powerful. Today, the government system is so robust that people expect the government to handle everything. Additionally, during elections and other occasions, people are often misled by unrealistic promises and inducements. How long can this system continue? If this trend persists, the country will go bankrupt.

 

Vikrama: Sangh has always maintained that it does not engage in politics. However, Sangh's swayamsevaks have an undeniable influence on politics. Within what is referred to as the Sangh Parivar, only one political party seems to stand out. Because of Sangh's influence over a single political party, hasn’t it distanced itself from influencing the entire Polity? Doesn’t this mean that instead of shaping statecraft, Sangh’s influence is now confined to politics?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: This concern is true to some extent. There are several reasons for this. Sangh has never held the stance that it must support only one political party. Swayamsevaks can work in any domain within the social or political system. However, what direction has politics in our country taken? Have the traditions of leaders like Gandhi, Malaviya, and Poornananda been preserved within those parties? When Pranab Mukherjee was in his party, he could not attend Sangh events. Why? Because political parties treated Sangh as untouchable in political circles. In Kochi, Kerala, a leader from the Communist Party once attended a Sangh event. For that reason, he was issued a notice and expelled from his party. So, who is truly practicing untouchability? Therefore, swayamsevaks have naturally aligned with the party  that does not insist on severing ties with the Sangh. When all doors are closed, one will enter through the door that remains open isn’t it? Let other parties allow their members to be part of the Sangh and also function in their party. If a Sangh swayamsevak joins a political party, that party gains a dedicated and honest worker. Won’t it? But if they choose to treat Sangh as untouchable, what can be done? There is also a fundamental ideological aspect to this. Swayamsevaks have accepted certain core principles, such as their stance on issues like minorities, caste, national unity, religious conversions, Article 370 and other issues. How can a swayamsevak function in a party that functions in direct opposition to these principles? If Sangh does not maintain open engagement with certain political parties, those parties themselves are responsible for it. Yet, at various levels, many Sangh leaders have maintained communication with leaders from different political parties on matters related to the nation, culture, and social service.

 

Vikrama: Sangh has repeatedly stated that it will not enter politics. However, in the past, it has also stated that it would not enter various other fields. For example, it initially said there was no need for publicity, yet when the necessity arose in the 1990s, the Prachar Vibhag was established. Sangh has adapted itself over time and has opened up to new areas as needed. In this context, if a situation arises where no political party can carry out the work necessary for society’s upliftment, will the Sangh reconsider and enter politics?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: No, that is not the case. Sangh never said it would not start a Prachar Vibhag. As I mentioned earlier, this is a process of progressive unfoldment. Dr. Hedgewar himself ensured that news related to the Sangh was written and published in newspapers. It was Sangh swayamsevaks who started Hindustan Samachar, Organiser, and Panchjanya, wasn’t it? The very magazine  where you serve as an editor was started by Sangh swayamsevaks in 1948, wasn’t it? As for politics, any swayamsevak who wishes to enter politics is free to do so. But Sangh itself will not function like a political party or become a political organisation. Office bearers of Sangh do not actively participate in political parties. Another important point is that when Sangh envisions a transformation for this nation, the role of the government is crucial. For instance, who is responsible for implementing education in mother-tongue, repealing Article 370, national security, cow protection, and anti-conversion laws? The government, of course. We do not disregard the role of the government.

 

Vikrama: Sangh believes that everyone in Bharat is a Hindu. The Sarsanghchalak has also stated that even Muslims and Christians in Bharat are Hindus. On what basis is Sangh making this assertion? Is it simply because they live in this country? Because they were born here? Or is it based on the claim that their DNA is the same as other Bharatiyas?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: It has been established that people in Bharat, regardless of their faith, language, or traditions, do not belong to different races. Dr. Babasaheb Ambedkar himself has stated this. Being a Hindu is not a religious identity. It is a way of life, as Dr. S. Radhakrishnan and even the Supreme Court of India have affirmed. The religion practised by Hindus is commonly referred to as Hindu Dharma, but in essence, it is Manava Dharma. The universal code of human values. Hindu is a geo-cultural identity. It is neither a sectarian nor a strictly religious concept. The Muslims in Bharat may have changed their religious practices. A Buddhist can become a Lingayat tomorrow, can he not? A Brahmin, if he chooses, can become a Buddhist, can he not? There are countless examples of siblings, husbands and wives from the same household following Shaivism and Vaishnavism individually and live together peacefully. The concept of Hindu was never restricted to a single sect or tradition. Merely converting to another religion should not mean severing one’s cultural and national identity. That is Sangh’s stance.

 

Vikrama: The idea of accepting others' way of worship applies to traditions like Jainism, Buddhism, and Sikhism, which originated in Bharat. However, foreign religions do not have provisions in their scriptures or beliefs to accept and allow ‘others’ to practice their traditions. Even if the Sangh considers them Hindus, do their religious practices allow for such an identity? How should this be understood?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: You are right. Those who founded Jainism and Buddhism in Bharat did not claim to establish separate religions. It was their disciples and followers who later turned them into distinct religious sects. When our elders said, Ekam Sat Viprah Bahudha Vadanti (Truth is one, but the wise call it by different names), wasn’t this the very thought behind it? Even Buddha himself said, Eshadharma Sanatanah, meaning that what he taught was part of the eternal Dharma. In the Sanatana tradition, both Vaidika and Avaidika traditions existed. Avaidika does not mean anti-Veda. It simply refers to a different stream of thought within Sanatana. This kind of spiritual democracy and freedom of thought has always existed in Bharat.

Dattatreya Hosabale: Bharatiya traditions, whether Jain, Buddhist, Lingayat, Shaiva, or Vaishnava, say, follow your tradition correctly, and you will attain Moksha. However, Semitic religions do not accept this idea. For instance, Christianity does not believe that salvation exists outside of its faith. Islam has a similar view. Thus, there is not just a cultural difference but a fundamental contradiction between Bharatiya traditions and Semitic religions that originated in foreign lands.

 

Vikrama: So, when Sangh says that Muslims and Christians are Hindus, does it mean that they become Hindus only if they leave their religion?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: There is no question of forcing anyone to leave their religion. Guruji Golwalkar was very clear about this. He once said, “Even a Muslim can sit next to me and offer namaz in the same temple where I perform puja. I have no objection”. We do not oppose anyone’s method of worship. The only condition is that their practices should not be against the cultural ethos of this land. It is the duty of the Hindu society to inspire in them a sense of belonging. If the Hindu society remains united, people will naturally feel drawn to it. Similarly, followers of foreign religions must also respect the traditions of others and must not attempt to convert others. 

 

Vikrama: Debates are taking place about the restoration of temples. The Sangh took up the Shri Ram Janmabhoomi movement under special circumstances, but the Sarsanghchalak has said that such movements will not be taken up in the future. However, many people, inspired by the Sangh’s work, are searching for temples beneath mosques and ruins, attempting to resolve these cases the way the Ram Janmabhoomi case was settled. Does Sangh support such efforts? Will it remain neutral? Or will it oppose them?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: This must be viewed in the context of the last 50 years. The Ram Janmabhoomi movement was not initiated by the Sangh. Many sadhus, saints, and mathadhipatis convened, discussed, and decided to reclaim Ram Janmabhoomi. They approached Sangh for support, and we agreed that, from a cultural perspective, reclaiming Ram Janmabhoomi and building a temple was necessary. At the time, the Vishwa Hindu Parishad and dharma gurus spoke about three temples . If some Sangh swayamsevaks are involved in efforts related to these three temples, Sangh is not stopping them. But if we talk about all the other mosques and structures, should we start digging up 30,000 mosques and attempt to reverse history? Would that not create more hostility and resentment in society? Should we move forward as a society or stay stuck in the past? How far back do we go in history? If we keep doing this, when will we focus on other vital societal transformations? What about eliminating untouchability? How do we instill values in youth? What about preserving our culture and languages? Should we abandon all of these and focus only on one issue? Today, society faces problems like conversions, cow slaughter, love jihad, and many other challenges. Sangh has never said anybody should ignore or not to work on these issues. Consider the concept of a temple. Is a former temple that has been turned into a mosque still a divine space? Should we focus on finding Hindutva in the remains of a stone structure, or should we awaken the Hindutva within those who have distanced themselves from it? Instead of searching for traces of Hindu heritage in stone buildings, if we revive the Hindu roots within them and their communities, the mosque issue will resolve on its own. 

 

Vikrama: Sangh envisions Param Vaibhav as its ultimate goal. But what are the milestones that indicate society is progressing toward this ideal? Without measurable markers, wouldn’t Param Vaibhav remain an abstract concept?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: The essence of Param Vaibhav is rooted in the Sangh's prayer, which speaks of Samutkarsha (material prosperity) and Nihshreyasa (spiritual fulfillment). what we might call Rama Rajya or Dharma Rajya encompasses both. Instead of fixed milestones, we can identify signs that indicate progress in this direction.

 

When families uphold strong values, harmony is ensured within the household. A family that earns as much as required to sustain itself is content with whatever it has gained. Untouchability has to be eradicated. National consciousness is visible in every sphere of life. Food, education, and knowledge have to reach everyone as per their needs. Social dignity and respect are accessible to all, without gender- or birth-based discrimination. Bharat has gained the strength to defend itself against both territorial and cultural invasions. Bharat possesses the power to aid any society, country, or civilization in distress. These are the indicators of a society moving toward Param Vaibhav. Rabindranath Tagore’s vision in ‘Where the Mind is Without Fear’ aligns with this ideal, as does the message of the Bhagavad Gita: "Yatra Yogeshwarah Krishna, Yatra Partho Dhanurdharah | Tatra Shri Vijayobhutir Dhruva Neetirmatirmama ||" (Wherever there is Krishna, the master of Yoga, and Arjuna, the wielder of the bow, there lies prosperity, victory, well-being, and unwavering morality.) This state of harmony, strength, and righteousness is Param Vaibhav.

 

Vikrama: Creating an environment where Hindus take pride in calling themselves Hindus and demonstrating that Hindus can be united are the greatest achievements of the Sangh in a hundred years. The impact of the Sangh’s work is considerable. However, due to certain government policies such as reservations (reservation for minorities) and educational benefits, many people are now saying they are not Hindus. How should this be viewed?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: Such things are happening today due to the pressures of the current socio-political situation. Who are Hindus in our society? Hindu society is like a ‘Kirana’ (grocery store). If you go to a Kirana and ask for one kilogram of ‘Kirana’, what will they give you? There is nothing called ‘Kirana’ by itself. There are pulses, coconuts, incense sticks, rice, and many other things. All of these together make up a Kirana store. No one is just a Hindu, but together, they are Hindus. Hinduism is not just a sect but a way of life, a cultural philosophy, and a tradition of many practices. Because some people lack this understanding, they say, “We are Jains" or "We are Lingayats”. They can say this only because they are already Hindus. Isn't this diversity a part of Hindu Dharma? This mindset is also somewhat influenced by the ideas introduced into our country’s education system since British times.

Dattatreya Hosabale: The structure of shakha involves conducting activities for one hour to develop physical, mental, and intellectual growth and ensuring that everyone gathers in one place at a designated time. The fundamental purpose is for everyone to come together. If today they play kabaddi in that space, tomorrow they might play volleyball. During COVID, when it was not possible to conduct shakha at the sanghasthan, we held griha shakhas (home-based shakhas) and virtual shakhas. Doctor Ji himself has said, “Even if everyone gathers in one place and sleeps under a blanket, wakes up, and leaves, that too can be called a shakha. The key idea is gathering together in one place”. The essence should be preserved while modifying the external structure according to circumstances. This has already been done in many places.

 

Now, Hindu families in foreign countries have found shakhas extremely attractive. This is because of the sense of belonging, values, and life lessons that shakha provides and are not found elsewhere. Discussions, analyses, and modifications on what kind of experiments can be conducted within shakhas take place periodically. The core philosophy should not change. The only mandate is that everyone must come together for a fixed time daily. It is only through gathering that values and organisation are built; otherwise, they will not develop. This has been Sangh’s experience.

 

Vikrama: As the Sangh steps into its second century, what would you like to say to the Sangh swayamsevaks and youth in general?

 

Dattatreya Hosabale: All of us must work to enhance the dignity of this nation. Every citizen must think about what their contribution to this cause should be. For that, one must dedicate some of one's time. A strong and prosperous India is not just for India itself. When India prospers, it must become a beacon that dispels the darkness of the world.

 

Swayamsevaks must dedicate their time, energy, and talent to bringing more and more people into this movement. They must forget minor differences and work together. They must make an effort to mobilise the virtuous and constructive forces present in society in this direction.

Vikrama Weekly: Vikrama Weekly was founded in 1948 and has its central office in Bengaluru, Karnataka. Vikrama is well-known among thinkers and writers in Karnataka for disseminating nationalist ideas. It celebrated its 75th anniversary two years ago. At a time when many weeklies and monthlies are shutting down, Vikrama continues to move forward with its dedicated readership. Vikrama Weekly is owned by Jnana Bharati Prakashana Pvt. Ltd.

Ramesh Doddapura: Ramesh Doddapura entered journalism through Vijayavani, Karnataka’s highest-circulating daily newspaper. He is particularly experienced in political reporting. In 2022, he worked as a senior sub-editor in the digital division of Vistara News. He authored ‘BJP 25+1’, a book on Karnataka politics, released in 2020. In 2023, he was honoured with the prestigious Khadri Shamanna Award by the Karnataka Working Journalists’ Association (KUWJ) for the best political analysis of the year. Since October 2023, he has been serving as the editor of Vikrama Weekly.